Rap culture in the 1990s was defined in part by the unending list of beefs that occurred between some of the genre’s biggest stars. Of the more memorable ones was the rift between Jay-Z and DMX during their prime years, and a recent interview on Power 105.1’s The Breakfast Club with Ruff Ryders founders Chivon Dean, Waah and Dee revealed a few inside details behind why that might’ve been so.

Jay-Z DMX Beef Egos Ruff Ryders Founders Breakfast Club Interview
Image: Scott Gries/ImageDirect/Getty

During the hour-long conversation, Chivron kept it 100 at the 54-minute mark to explain the rift between Hov and Dark Man X, chucking it up simply to “egos” of the two multiplatinum emcees. Waah followed up with more details, adding, “They had that past history of competition, and that’s the reason why it didn’t happen” in reference to why both artists couldn’t find a way to work together when Jay became president of Def Jam in 2004. “Jay-Z called DMX and told him, ‘The inmates took over the prison,'” says Waah, further adding, “”X felt that [Jay-Z] didn’t honor him in the proper way.” Dee also explained that it all truly originated from the infamous pool hall rap battle in the Bronx that Jay and X went bar for bar in during the early 90s before both were even famous, stating, “”We called it a draw because they both was nice — X felt like he won, Hov gonna feel like he won — so it was an animosity there always.” As we know now, both guys were able to work past their issues and currently exist as rap legends on their respective thrones.

Watch the full interview below to get a deeper explanation on the whole Jay-Z and DMX beef and gems from the Ruff Ryders history as a whole: